{"id":33658,"date":"2020-05-20T10:23:02","date_gmt":"2020-05-20T15:23:02","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/adpulp.wpengine.com\/?p=33658"},"modified":"2020-05-20T10:24:04","modified_gmt":"2020-05-20T15:24:04","slug":"the-adpulp-interview-katherine-hollar-barnard","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.adpulp.com\/the-adpulp-interview-katherine-hollar-barnard\/","title":{"rendered":"The Adpulp Interview: Katherine Hollar Barnard"},"content":{"rendered":"

Katherine Hollar Barnard is a force, a dynamo, a badass. She’s the founder and CEO at Firesign<\/a> in Kansas City, which offers “enlightened legal marketing” to its clients. We became friends two years ago and I want to mention why that is. This lady is fierce. I admire this in her, and in others. Katie is also brilliant and funny. Plus, she’s a straight-shooting Midwesterner who loves sports and barbecue. In other words, she is the kind of person\u2014complex and<\/em> real\u2014who is easy to like. I am thrilled that she chose to participate in this series, because Katie is someone you want to know, and when you work in the legal profession she is someone you must know<\/em>.<\/p>\n

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Q. How does living and working in Kansas City shape your point of view? <\/strong><\/p>\n

A. Blame it on my roots, I showed up in boots\u2026<\/p>\n

Kansas City has an informal air and a frontier spirit, and I think both of these traits shape my point of view and my agency. We value straight talk and straight prose. We mean what we say. We back it up.<\/p>\n

Q. We met in a coaching class in 2018. What was your one big takeaway from the class and coaching experience generally?<\/strong><\/p>\n

A. Our class aimed to teach agency owners how to build online courses. I launched one, and while it\u2019s certainly not a mainstay of my agency right now, I appreciated the exercise a lot. I think so many of us get caught up in starting every single project from scratch, every time, and it\u2019s helpful as a business owner to think about productizing.<\/p>\n

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Q. What\u2019s the difference between an expert and a coach?<\/strong><\/p>\n

A. With an expert, you get a monologue; with a coach, you get dialogue.<\/p>\n

Q. Why and how did you start your own agency?<\/strong><\/p>\n

A. For 12 years, I worked inside the marketing departments at large corporate law firms; I served as chief marketing officer at Lathrop & Gage (now Lathrop GPM) and Shook, Hardy & Bacon. I had the privilege of leading the rebranding at Shook, which won \u201cBest Identity\u201d from the Legal Marketing Association \u2013 Midwest. I loved it, and I was so proud of it \u2013 and then profoundly sad that I wouldn\u2019t get to do a project like that for another 10 years.<\/p>\n

Long story short, I launched my agency in February 2017, and I\u2019ve done three branding projects this year.<\/p>\n

Q. Blair Enns and many other small agency consultants believe in an extreme focus on the one thing you do best, so you\u2019re the only one doing that? What\u2019s your agency\u2019s one thing?<\/strong><\/p>\n

A. Our one thing is the legal industry: We are solely focused on serving law firms, legal technology companies and the like. I was a two-time law firm CMO; our vice president ran PR inside a law firm; our creative director had a short stint as a paralegal before she went to design school.<\/p>\n

Lawyer jokes aside, it\u2019s a great demographic to work with: Attorneys have high standards, and it\u2019s inspiring to work with smart people doing big things. I\u2019m working right now with a law firm that does a lot of Innocence Project work, and another focused on helping veterans. The legal profession is crucial to protecting justice, civility, and innovation, and it\u2019s fulfilling to be a part of that.<\/p>\n

Q. When you hire someone new, what\u2019s the one thing that you need to see in them?<\/strong><\/p>\n

A. What I\u2019d call \u201clight in the eyes.\u201d Hustle. Spirit. Levity. Scrappiness. I can teach you how to write a press release. I can\u2019t teach you how to care.<\/p>\n

Q. Are law firms male-dominated and how do you navigate that when working with legal clients?<\/strong><\/p>\n

A. Law firms are<\/em> male-dominated. That\u2019s changing, but slowly. It makes it a little extra exciting when we work with women-owned firms, but throughout my career, I\u2019ve been blessed to work with some truly outstanding gentlemen. I\u2019ve also bought myself a pair of boots with my earnings from a firm basketball betting pool.<\/p>\n

Q. What elements make for a great client?<\/strong><\/p>\n

A. It is gratifying when clients respect that marketing is an expertise. It is fun when clients are enthusiastic and when they want to actively participate. And it is rewarding when they keep you posted and let you know how your work impacts their business \u2013 weeks, months, and years later.<\/p>\n

Q. Is it important for your business growth that you win awards? <\/strong><\/p>\n

A. I\u2019d fall back to what I tell my clients: It\u2019s unlikely that an award is going to win you business on its own, but it may nudge a decision. It\u2019s like USDA-approved on meat: You were hungry, you were going to buy a steak, but the badge makes you feel a little safer about it.<\/p>\n

Q. What about PR? How critical is PR to your own marketing mix and how important is it for your legal clients?<\/strong><\/p>\n

A. I have a model of marketing tactics that I present to clients. It\u2019s the solar system, and the client is the sun \u2013 the source of warmth and heat and billable hours. Each planet represents a different tactic, and the closer they are to the \u201csun,\u201d the more of an impact you can expect. Mercury is the in-person meeting; Venus is a speaking engagement; and so on. Perhaps PR is Earth \u2013 a great place to live, but cold half the year if you\u2019re not trying anything else!<\/p>\n

In legal, I\u2019ve seen no substitute for meetings and presentations. I liken it to Costco samples \u2013 lawyers, in particular, like to see how you operate, see that you\u2019re a safe choice.<\/p>\n

Q. What do clients not understand about content and social media marketing?<\/strong><\/p>\n

A. We can\u2019t just take website copy and regurgitate it. The best, most effective content has a personality and stands for something. Two of my favorite examples of legal content \u2013 neither of which we did, but man, I wish we had:<\/p>\n